BUG: Freeze during saving project

This discussion was created from comments split from: Am I right in saying that no one has found a bug yet?.

Comments

  • edited December 2018

    I have a project that can no longer be saved. I cannot overwrite it or save to a new filename as it just freezes.

    The project right before this one is pretty much identical to it (all the same instruments/AUs etc, just a couple different notes) but it can be saved. So no work lost but just one strangely uncooperative project.

    PS. Many many many pleasurable hours in. :)

  • @Audiogus said:
    I have a project that can no longer be saved. I cannot overwrite it or save to a new filename as it just freezes.

    The project right before this one is pretty much identical to it (all the same instruments/AUs etc, just a couple different notes) but it can be saved. So no work lost but just one strangely uncooperative project.

    PS. Many many many pleasurable hours in. :)

    I had that happen. It had several AU’s in it but who knows if that had anything to do with it. Otherwise no issues at all.

  • edited December 2018

    Can you please try to remove AUs one by one and always try save ? To identify if it is caused by some particular plugin.

  • edited December 2018

    @dendy said:
    Can you please try to remove AUs one by one and always try save ? To identify if it is caused by some particular plugin.

    Very interesting. It seems like it could be a bug with Aparillo. If I just change the patch to a new one then go back to the old one it saves fine without even unloading the AU.

    Also, I noticed that the patch save option in Aparillo is sometimes missing... could be related...?


  • Interesting. Aparillo came out right before NS2 launched, so it was probably not tested in NS2 before now. I just got the app but my internet went down so I couldn’t do the IAP for AUv3. Doh! Hopefully tomorrow I can get online long enough to get full functionality and test it inside NS2 some. Some great sounds on that synth. Noteworthy that it doesn’t support ...(cough!)IAA.

  • edited December 2018

    @Audiogus good find ! Now, you're only one step from being proper beta tester which maaaybe one day will be as good as me :trollface: :trollface:

    Can you please try same plugin / same preset in other DAW ? Ideally more if you have (BM3, Cubasis)
    Just to be sure this is really NS2 related issue ..

    Thanks !

    Also, I noticed that the patch save option in Aparillo is sometimes missing... could be related...?

    Yeah, this is strange, may be related, maybe be reason or just side effect caused by something else..

  • @dendy said:
    @Audiogus good find ! Now, you're only one step from being proper beta tester which maaaybe one day will be as good as me :trollface: :trollface:

    Can you please try same plugin / same preset in other DAW ? Ideally more if you have (BM3, Cubasis)
    Just to be sure this is really NS2 related issue ..

    Thanks !

    Also, I noticed that the patch save option in Aparillo is sometimes missing... could be related...?

    Yeah, this is strange, may be related, maybe be reason or just side effect caused by something else..

    I have used Aparillo a fair bit in BM3 already and it has been ok. I think it is posible that I was simply running too many different AUs at the same time and it resulted in a project corruption. It almost seems like Apple lets you load load load until things barf barf barf when really the OS should have some memory guidelines, be a good barkeep and tell you when you’ve had enough.

  • edited December 2018

    @dendy

    As for the save patch option disappearing and reappearing I have not had that hapen in BM3.

  • Interesting. A hard boot fixed my unsavable project, despite also doing several memory resets. Maybe some cache/temp file was the culprit?

  • edited December 2018

    Did you also try open completely new project, insert there just Apparilo - can you then reproduce this bug ?

    It almost seems like Apple lets you load load load until things barf barf barf when really the OS should have some memory guidelines, be a good barkeep and tell you when you’ve had enough.

    Yes, this is exactly how it works in iOS. It simply starts kill processes without notify them, at least based on my knowledge. iOS is still wild west for poor apps :lol:

  • @dendy said:
    Thing is that too much AU's can eat your memory very quickly. BAnd then all kinds of unexpeced random things can happen. Althought this looks weird to me.

    Did you also try open completely new project, insert there just Apparilo - can you then reproduce this bug ?

    I have Aparillo on three different projects and so far this only happened once.

  • I had a project with only NS2 sounds start to get a little laggy at the 6 minute mark, some delay fx. Might be an iPad Pro issue, basically the screen was unresponsive for a few seconds, luckily the app didn’t crash and resumed normal operations after a few seconds.

  • edited December 2018

    Guys. I'm sure Matt doesn't want to hear about such strange hard to reproduce mysterious events :mrgreen: Those are most hated issues amongs developers, i know it because i'm one too (althought not ios based).

  • @Blip Interactive I sent a link to a project file with this issue via the contact section of the site. Did you get it?

  • @dendy said:
    Guys. I'm sure Matt doesn't want to hear about such strange hard to reproduce mysterious events :mrgreen: Those are most hated issues amongs developers, i know it because i'm one too (althought not ios based).

    Including mine?

  • @Audiogus said:

    Very interesting. It seems like it could be a bug with Aparillo. If I just change the patch to a new one then go back to the old one it saves fine without even unloading the AU.

    Also, I noticed that the patch save option in Aparillo is sometimes missing... could be related...?

    I’ve also had these exact two issues with Aparillo in NS2.

  • @anickt - Yes, I got your project - thanks for that, very good of you to put the time in. I've had it open in a window for a couple of days now but every time I try to start looking into in depth, something else comes along!

    What I've managed to find so far is that there's a temp file of zero size in there. To avoid your project file being corrupted, NS2 begins by writing it to a temp file. If that's successful it then:

    1. Removes the older backup project (.bak)
    2. Renames your current project as the backup
    3. Moves the temp file into place as the newly saved project

    It looks to me like it started the initial save to the temp file, something went wrong and it didn't get any further, but fortunately your previous saves should be OK. Unfortunately I can't get any info from the temp file as it's empty.

    I'm 99% sure this is going to be some sort of issue with an AU as I've never seen this before in many, many saves. If so, it's probably going to be a case of building up some experience with it until we can start narrowing down on a common factor. Would I be right in saying that you were using Aparillo but you were also using other AUs too? If so, Aparillo might be a possibility but we can't be sure until we've ruled out the other unknowns.

    If this happens to someone in future who's only using one type of AU, that would be a really good lead to follow. And there's always the possibility it could be a low memory issue if you were using a lot of AUs since iOS doesn't have a particularly graceful way of handling it. Still, blaming it on low memory seems like a bit of a dismissive excuse, so it would be a last resort explanation for me.

    So I'd say the best approach is to build up a bit more experience and hopefully a common factor will emerge so I can narrow it down.

  • edited December 2018

    I bought Aparillo .. will apply all my torturing knowledge to it ..

  • Yah, I wager it is a case of excessive AU use on my part that lead to troubles as that is my iOS MO.

    Can't wait for track freezing / audio tracks to alleviate this congestion. I hate using a whole Au slot for a looping Model D baseline but I don't want to commit to audio/slate just yet and then lose my AU settings etc etc.

  • @dendy said:
    I bought Aparillo .. will apply all my torturing knowledge to it ..

    I was also running it with one Model D and three Synthmaster Ones. It seems like I can only do two Synthmaster Ones safely though as when I browse patches on the third instance it inevitably bugs out and I have to restart NS2.

  • edited December 2018

    Can't wait for track freezing / audio tracks to alleviate this congestion. I hate using a whole Au slot for a looping Model D baseline but I don't want to commit to audio/slate just yet and then lose my AU settings etc etc.

    Man, you should really give a try to that mixdown -> load to Slate pads workflow ..With NS1 id did whole album with this approach - basically every track just 16 instances of fully loaded TRGs with such loops with length from few seconds up to half minute :) It's not that bad how it looks when you work this way for a while :)

  • edited December 2018

    @dendy said:

    Can't wait for track freezing / audio tracks to alleviate this congestion. I hate using a whole Au slot for a looping Model D baseline but I don't want to commit to audio/slate just yet and then lose my AU settings etc etc.

    Man, you should really give a try to that mixdown -> load to Slate pads workflow ..With NS1 id did whole album with this approach - basically every track just 16 instances of fully loaded TRGs with such loops with length from few seconds up to half minute :) It's not that bad how it looks when you work this way for a while :)

    Yah I am familiar with that workflow but have (cough) 'another app' I do that with which for me is better at it. ;)

    I am most looking forward to using NS2 to sequence my laptop VSTs this weekend though. I imagine that will be awesome. :)

  • @Blip Interactive said:
    @anickt - Yes, I got your project - thanks for that, very good of you to put the time in. I've had it open in a window for a couple of days now but every time I try to start looking into in depth, something else comes along!

    What I've managed to find so far is that there's a temp file of zero size in there. To avoid your project file being corrupted, NS2 begins by writing it to a temp file. If that's successful it then:

    1. Removes the older backup project (.bak)
    2. Renames your current project as the backup
    3. Moves the temp file into place as the newly saved project

    It looks to me like it started the initial save to the temp file, something went wrong and it didn't get any further, but fortunately your previous saves should be OK. Unfortunately I can't get any info from the temp file as it's empty.

    I'm 99% sure this is going to be some sort of issue with an AU as I've never seen this before in many, many saves. If so, it's probably going to be a case of building up some experience with it until we can start narrowing down on a common factor. Would I be right in saying that you were using Aparillo but you were also using other AUs too? If so, Aparillo might be a possibility but we can't be sure until we've ruled out the other unknowns.

    If this happens to someone in future who's only using one type of AU, that would be a really good lead to follow. And there's always the possibility it could be a low memory issue if you were using a lot of AUs since iOS doesn't have a particularly graceful way of handling it. Still, blaming it on low memory seems like a bit of a dismissive excuse, so it would be a last resort explanation for me.

    So I'd say the best approach is to build up a bit more experience and hopefully a common factor will emerge so I can narrow it down.

    Agreed - I’ll let you know if I come across anything of interest. Thanks

  • Interesting. I had this happen again with another project that also uses Apparillo. After hard booting I found that I could load the project but both Aparillo and Egoist reverted to default patches.

    Both are by Sugar Bytes.

    Synthmaster One, Zeeon and all of the various AU FX semed uneffected.

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